Beloit College President Eric Boynton sat down with The Round Table on October 11.
Below is a lightly edited transcript of the interview conducted by The Round Table editors-in-chief Eric Seo and Ezekiel Kingsbury.
Ezekiel Kingsbury: We have, like, a couple of segments of questions.
Eric Boynton: Great.
Kingsbury: And so, yeah, thanks for agreeing to meet with us. Eric, do you wanna start?
Eric Seo: Sure. Again, thanks for meeting us.
Boynton: Yeah.
Seo: And some of the questions come from us, other people, some students DM’d us on Instagram, things like that.
Boynton: Sure.
Seo: So just sort of a field of questions from all over the place. And I guess I could start with, like, just generally, what are your current overarching goals for the college?
Boynton: Current overarching goals. Just – North Star is student experience. So think about the experience that students have on campus academically, socially, living on campus, the whole residential affair. So if we keep our eyes focused on that, right, that’s a sure way to build in success for the institution going forward. So that’s some of the changes. Right? So thinking about the DNA of a small liberal arts place, which is just breadth of training, you gotta have access to all sorts of disciplines at the same time. You put roots down in one particular discipline. But then right now, it’s, you know, where does that lead me? Where does that lead to the 1st job or the 5th job? So think about professions not leaving that behind. Think about students’ concerns and anxieties about the future, building that into the curriculum. So, you know, schools and impact void are part of that. But the other thing is the investment on the physical spaces on campus. You know, we need to start up the dorm renovations. Thinking about Pearsons and food, thinking about food in general, accentuating the places where we have new kitchens to properly engage in the food service that is healthy and, and tasty.
Kingsbury: Could I ask a follow-up? Mhmm. And it’s kind of a 2 parter, I guess. So you talked about, like, the schools or whatever.
Boynton: Yeah.
Kingsbury: It kind of seems like this is changing, like, the trajectory of the culture, at least the way that it’s structured. Do you see it that way? Or—
Boynton: I see it’s the way it’s structured, but it’s not the trajectory. It’s actually doubling down on the mission of the place as a small liberal arts institution.
Seo: So, could you define that?
Boynton: Yeah. The mission is preparing students to successfully navigate the world. So the liberal in liberal arts is the Latin term for free. So the ability to freely navigate the world. Some of you talk about that is lifelong learning ability to, you know, to, think through different kinds of problems. So skills around productive collaboration, creative problem solving, effective communication in order to be agile intellectually and professionally. So that’s what we’ve done for hundreds of years, almost hundreds of years, preparing students to to navigate the world, finding your way. A lot of that means finding your way through careers and professions. Right?
Kingsbury: Right. But, I mean, on career I mean, right now, there’s a, there’s a, I think, national discussion of, like, shifting liberal arts colleges towards more career specific goals. And a lot of people do see this is eroding the values of, like, the liberal arts.
Boynton: Mhmm.
Kingsbury: And the question, I guess, is are career-oriented skills sufficient?
Boynton: I love the question. I see the professional skills and liberal liberal arts, skills as not being mutually exclusive. They’re actually one and the same. So as a philosophy professor, as a humanist, right, are we gonna have philosophy courses on in Beloit campus? Yes. Are we gonna have a philosophy major? Yes. We are. Right? We’re gonna continue to teach those humanistic liberal arts soaked kinds of experiences. What I will say is that liberal arts has adapted and changed over millennia. I mean, if you wanna go back to the Greeks, you could say you’re founded this kind of way of thinking about education adapted differently by the Romans, came into force with the rise of German universities about 300 years ago.
Kingsbury: Sure.
Boynton: So each of these things had a different so this is an ongoing living, breathing way of educating someone. It’s trying to get a hold of the whole person. So I’m not just gonna tell you or teach you how to weld. I’m gonna engage your mind and your body in ways that prepare you for what’s coming next. So the jobs I’m preparing you for are not the first job that you have or the 5th job. It’s like the 8th job or the ability to move through the world. So I’m not gonna… we’re still not going to educate someone to teach a particular vocation. We’re gonna..
Kingsbury: So you’re not going to educate somebody to teach a particular vocation?
Boynton: We’re not gonna teach someone to engage in a particular kind of vocation. Okay. You’ll find yourself in a particular vocation. Right? But the breadth of the training is wider than that. That’s what this is about. So, there was a time not too long ago where every single student would have to take a philosophy course in order to graduate from liberal arts. Very few institutions do that anymore. Philosophy is still among liberal arts institutions. But to think that somehow liberal arts is built around certain disciplines is a wrong way to think about liberal arts. The right way to think about liberal arts is it’s organizing the curriculum in order to teach people in holistic ways. Does that make sense? So..
Kingsbury: Yeah. That does make sense. But I mean, there is a difference between different subjects though. Right? Like, there’s a difference between engineering and philosophy.
Boynton: Sure.
Kingsbury: One of them is specifically for, I don’t know, a future career. The other one, not so much. It’s for the love of learning. Right? And so removing the the requirement to philosophy is a fundamental change in the focus of the liberal arts.
Boynton: So here’s what I’m saying is that we still have a major in philosophy. And the other thing is that we could just move away from engineering because engineering is something we lead, we prepare people to go on the engineering school. Right? Physics major is one of those 2 majors. Right? Physics is broader than engineering. But if you talk about the nursing program we have on campus right now. Right? So through the partnership in Edgewood.
Kingsbury: Mhmm.
Boynton: Right? So there’s a way in which we’re moving the ways of preparing students to think about a career in nursing. Here’s what I’m gonna say to that. For society, for those individuals that wanna go into nursing, we should not cede ground. Liberal arts should not cede ground to other universities or colleges and give them over all the ways in which we train and educate nurses. Nurses should have access and should be trained in liberal arts environments in order to make them better, more complete nurses. You you with me there? Like like, I just I don’t wanna say, oh, we’re only learning for learning’s sake and all the other stuff is vocation. I think that’s BS, frankly. I think there’s a way, and Beloit has always done this. It has his practical, pragmatic side to it. I mean, this goes back to the field term and the Beloit plan. We, during the, you know, like, mid sixties or seventies, you guys, you had to go off campus. Right? And not only go off campus. You had to go work off campus. And bring that experience back into your classes in order to properly understand what this education is doing for you as a human being as you go forward. I just don’t see those things as mutually exclusive.
Kingsbury: Thank you. Let’s move on.
Boynton: Yeah. I’m passionate about that.
Kingsbury: So, our next question, partially comes from some faculty, some students. How does your administration’s vision differ from the previous administration’s goals?
Seo: One example that was brought up by a few different people was there’s less of an emphasis on anti-racism now versus the previous administration.
Boynton: So I there’s an emphasis on discussions within the learning environment. I don’t think that’s gone away. We still have all the majors. We have those classes that deal with issues of, racial inequity and injustice. All those are still built in the curriculum. It’s woven into very fabric of the place. Right? What I wanna have is a college and university where we’re able to chew on all those ideas within the learning environment.
Kingsbury: What do you think is different about your goals? What new thing do you think you brought that the last guy didn’t?
Boynton: Yeah. So this is a hard job, and so I’m not throwing anybody under the bus. Right? This is not that kind of question I imagine you’re asking.
Kingsbury: No.
Boynton: So what I would say to that is, I wanna have a campus where all those hard discussions are able to be had within the classroom. So, I wanna have a campus that has free inquiry built in the very fabric of the place, which means all ideas need to be talked about in the classroom. So there’s ways in which we need to get better at properly understanding and expressing our commitments and values because a lot of us come with disheveled visions of what we’re about. We need to gather the disheveled ideas we have, hone them, make students better able to express, communicate, and write about their commitments. That’s what this college is about. Does that make sense?
Seo: I’ve got another question for you. Bit of a a non sequitur here. Can you describe the financial situation of the college? I mean, that’s what people are curious about.
Boynton: Sure. So there are massive headwinds facing down small liberal arts. So higher ed in general is topsy-turvy. I mean, it’s an industry that is under significant change right now. And one of the reasons is demography. So there are fewer college-age students, right, in this country right now, and that’s a factor of the 2008, great recession. They stopped making babies. And so you actually see, you run that ahead 17 or 18 years, and there’s just fewer people of college age in this country right now. On top of that, there’s a perception that college isn’t worth it. And so participation rates among that demography is also shrinking as well. So there’s about a million less students over the last 5 years going to college each and every year. Within Wisconsin, it’s like something like 100,000 people, or fewer going to college each and every year in Wisconsin. So demography is working against the, you can call it higher end industry. Right? Because we’re actually bringing students in, preparing, and transforming their lives. There are fewer students out there, so you can imagine it’s getting more competitive. So one of the things we have to do as a college is to remain relevant to the current situation so the parents and students see this place as valuable. So that’s a lot of the changes we’re talking about. The student focus, the student experience focus is ways to ensure that this is there’s a healthy future for this college by paying attention to what’s out there, ensuring that we can enroll classes, right, that are above 300 students entering class, right, at a certain tuition rate that allows us to find our healthy equilibrium going forward.
Kingsbury: Sorry. Just to clarify. So your aim is above 300?
Boynton: For the entering classes. That’s right.
Seo: So you talked about, like, the enrollment problem, I suppose. Can you talk about the current financial situation of the college?
Boynton: You know, we’re doing fine. We have an endowment that’s $90,000,000, something like that. We have a 4-year plan that takes us to financial equilibrium going forward. So, yeah, we’re doing fine. We’re, understanding that there has to be change in the institutional like Beloit in order to map on the change out there in the world, and that’s what we’re doing.
Kingsbury: But, like, the Neese Theater is—
Boynton: So this is what it changes. So for instance, the Neese theater, that building itself requires a major overhaul. It’s not ADA-compliant. We can’t get in there. The amount of money it would take to create Neese as a viable space ought to be thought of differently. Let’s go ahead and and lock it down for a few years, do a study of it. The building becomes 50 years old, I think this November, which means it’s access to historic tax credits. So it opens up all possibilities for the Neese theater we wouldn’t have otherwise if we started now. Okay. And in the meantime, go down and refresh to Hendricks with the new, performing arts and theater major. Right? Put emphasis down there in Hendricks, which is a signature building, which is a new building, and build out the spaces down there for performances.
Seo: You say, financially, we’re doing fine.
Boynton: Mhmm.
Seo: Is there any way you could speak a little bit to why you think the perception is not that? A lot of people on campus think that the college is financially struggling. So if you say we’re doing fine, then why do a majority of people on campus think otherwise?
Boynton: Because there’s change, and there has been a drop in enrollment over the last few years, which is what this change is about to rectify that situation. So we do need to be a steady state of over 1000 students on this campus. Right?
Kingsbury: What are we at right now?
Boynton: Pushing almost 1000 students.
Kingsbury: Okay.
Boynton: Like, right, like, 900. It’s like yeah. It’s depending on how you count it because there’s different ways the government asks us to count students. Yeah. And then one reckoning, it’s like 990. You know, the reckon is 962.
Kingsbury: It’s somewhere upper pushing.
Boynton: That’s right.
Seo: So if, if you say people think that, the college is struggling because of all these changes and you say we’re doing fine because we’re doing these changes, does it.. are you implying, like, we will be doing fine once the changes are implemented or…
Boynton: Just, your word “struggle.” Right? Okay. So the college needs to be doing better than it is.
Seo: Certainly.
Boynton: Yeah. And I think that’s what people are picking up on.
Seo: Understood.
Boynton: Does that make sense?
Seo: Yes.
Boynton: Yeah. So I’m not saying: “Look. We’re fine. We’re gonna stay exactly the same.”
Seo: Sure.
Boynton: No.Obviously, we’re engaged in these changes because you want to find a different situation for ourselves. Does that make sense?
Kingsbury: When is the construction, on campus, like, the holes or the library or whatever. When can we expect the…
Boynton: The holes, which are massive. Right? That was supposed to be that’s city work. That’s not—
Kingsbury: Yeah. I understand that.
Boynton: That was supposed to be done this summer before you guys arrived. And it wasn’t. And there’s reasons for that. We had to go through the city had to go through federal hoops in order to start to work. The person that was gonna unlock, the the gate so they would get the work going was on vacation for 3 weeks. It’s that silly. Okay. And then so they started late. And then the work itself, which was 2 weeks, is now 8 weeks.
Kingsbury: So we can expect maybe next semester?
Boynton: No. It’s within weeks. You know, you could talk to, like, Nate Osterberger. He would know exactly. It’s within weeks. And then the library issue, that was gonna be done except for the flooding that happened that set that first floor way back.
Kingsbury: Yeah.
Boynton: And then they set back the whole, space in the north side. We had to rethink how the culverts work. Right?
Kingsbury: Yeah. And it looks like they’re almost done there.
Boynton: They’re almost done there. So is it October? So by the end of October, that’s what I’m hearing. That will be all ready to go, and we’ll have, like, a celebration of the opening of the entire library. And, of course, that library was funded mainly by a state grant, and so we’ll invite state officials down for that. And they’ll have, like, a big pair of scissors. You know? Those things. Are you gonna do you guys wanna come?
Seo: We’ll take a picture.
Boynton: Okay.
Seo: Some students have told us that they don’t feel like their opinions are being considered when the college is making these changes. What do you think about that, and how do you, and your administration incorporate student opinion when making these decisions?
Boynton: Right. So, a lot of these plans around construction were consultative of student groups. Like, the food group was important in thinking about the kitchens.
Kingsbury: Which food group?
Boynton: The one that was on campus last..
Kingsbury: The food oversight committee?
Boynton: Yeah.
Kingsbury: I was on that committee, and we never heard anything about a change in location.
Boynton: Okay. The students were consulted in this change in location. What’s going on in Commons right now is that the kitchens needed an overhaul. The amount of overhaul was larger than what it would take to move the food into the powerhouse. So it was both, being financially clever and responsible, moving the food over there, but also moving food into the signature space in the Powerhouse, building out those kitchens that were new over there, and just extending that a bit in order to have more room to feed students on the powerhouse side.
Kingsbury: But more broadly, how do you, like, reach out to students to get their input on things like this?
Boynton: So it’s through committee work, inviting students, and the committee work, inviting students in the meeting.
Kingsbury: Mhmm.
Boynton: It’s through student life, canvassing, and talking to students. BSG, those kinds of groups.
Kingsbury: Some people have said that they do not feel that the administration takes Title 9 seriously. They’ve experienced a lackluster effort by ResLife to address these concerns. The flyers in the bathroom still have Ryan Schamp’s name on it, for example. [Ryan Schamp was the director of Residential Life from 2019-2022.] And there’s been a growing discussion around this, especially online, in the past few weeks. What are your thoughts on that?
Boynton: Mhmm. Well, Title 9 is a crucial component of the function of the campus and keeping our students safe. It’s a federally mandated regulation. And, of course, those regulations change with every administration because different politicians didn’t hire different directors of the Department of Education. Department of Education mandates how the timeline looks. So over the summer, there was a new regulation that was put into effect by the Biden administration. So it took them 3 ish years. So that’s working through the system right now. So there’s new ways in which Title 9 is being, applied on college campuses. Those regulations are completely out of our hands. We have to comply with those federal regulations when you go through our business. There is a you know, I understand that part of the, the frustration is that there is confidentiality and issues that have to be abided by by federal regulation. So there’s certain statements that the campus can’t make to protect the confidentiality of those people who are being adjudicated within Title 9. Those kinds of nuances, you know, I don’t live that world every day. This is, dean of students, student life, that understand those regulations all the more. So but know that we’re looking to those federal regulations and follow those to a tee because if you don’t, it’s bad both for the institution and the students who are, locked in timeline issues.
Kingsbury: But, like, the bathroom signs—
Boynton: So thank you thank you for telling me that. So we can — that’s something we can do. Like I said, I did not know that. Yeah.
Kingsbury: I mean, just like paying more attention to stuff like this. I think a lot of students… It’s just it signals a lack of investment
Boynton: Mhmm.
Kingsbury: Things like that, which I think is what people are responding to. Okay. But that’s just..
Boynton: Yeah. I appreciate that. Yeah.
Seo: So sort of on a similar note. Some students and the newspaper is wondering on an administrative level, what does it look like behind the scenes when, like, a student incident occurs? Specifically, we’re kind of referring to last semester, with the the video that kind of spread online. What does the response look like that students can’t see?
Boynton: So, right. So I don’t know how to answer that question. Right? So there’s a stipulation within the APM and within the student handbook, and those are the regulations that we have to follow. So I could read those out to you. Those are the regulations we have to follow.
Kingsbury: Let’s just talk about this incident in specific. The video spread, I think it was April 29th. Everybody comes together. April 30th, Dean of Students puts out an announcement, I think where it was like, you know, “this isn’t us.” After that point, are you calling individuals in? Are you meeting with people?
Boynton: Yeah. Following the stipulations on the regulations that we have written down. We have to follow those legally.
Kingsbury: Yeah.
Boynton: But whatever is written down in the in the student handbook and then the APM, we follow those. So yes. Mhmm.
Kingsbury: Is there a trial? I mean, we can look it up after.
Boynton: Yeah. There’s steps that we take. Okay. And it involves interviewing, students and others. Just to clear, I mean, I can’t go in. I can’t… Yeah. But at the same time, we actively engage in the process of investigation. I mean, that is 100% true. I mean, these things are not just walked away from. We have to understand, by our own stipulations, we have to understand what happened there in order to take the appropriate action. That understanding is something that is scrutinized by legal in order that we don’t find ourselves not following our regulations. If we don’t follow our regulations, that’s bad for the institution. That’s bad for the students.
Kingsbury: Mhmm.
Boynton: So know that there is an investigation. There is a study. There are, 1 on 1, interviews with people who are affected in order to understand. And there are reports written, and the reports actually, right, follow the stipulations we have.
Seo: I’m sure some students would be comforted to..
Boynton: But then those those reports cannot be divulged. Of course. Yeah. Right? And then depending on how the whole thing gets adjudicated at the end, there’s more or less lockdown of those things as well. Does that make sense? But none of this is not paid attention to. If we don’t pay attention to it, woe to us. And when I mean us, it’s not just the administration because you guys are all part of this team. Right? It’s woe to the campus if we don’t follow our own stipulations.
Kingsbury: I am curious what could be done, maybe, to, without breaking those confidentiality things, kind of ease students, because it does appear and this is part of, like, the confidentiality thing. Something happens—
Boynton: Mhmm. Mhmm.
Kingsbury: —And then the administration goes silent.
Boynton: So on this one in particular, you might wanna talk to, I mean, I just, if you wanna get more interesting, at some point when you ask me these kind of questions yeah. I’m at 30,000 foot. Right? I know what’s going on, but you might have really interesting conversations to talk to Cecil and Ron Watson, for instance.
Kingsbury: Yep.
Boynton: On this particular one, you might actually wanna follow-up with them.
Seo: Sure.
Kingsbury: Shifting away. Do you read The Round Table?
Boynton: I do. I do!
Kingsbury: What’s our role on campus in your eyes?
Boynton: I think it’s a wonderful way to inform students on how to think about their experience. So it’s one perspective on the college, a broad perspective. You get a whole bunch of voices in there in one written document. So this is how I think about it. I’m not a real social media kind of guy, but it’s all dispersed out there. Right? That you follow or who you listen to. The Round Table is like this place where it all comes together in one place. I imagine you have a whole bunch of different views and perspectives and writing styles and people, but it’s one place you go to read it all. That’s what I find outside of it.
Kingsbury: A printed document.
Boynton: Yeah. A printed document.
Seo: Do you think that there’s value in it being in print?
Boynton: I kinda wanna ask that of you guys. Like, because it should be 1st and foremost, it’s for your fellow students. Right?
Seo: Of course.
Boynton: So if it’s for your fellow students, I gotta kinda ask you, where should it belong? Where to be most effective at?
Kingsbury: I am of the opinion…
Boynton: Yeah.
Seo: I personally support print media.
Kingsbury: Because you walk into Pearson’s and then…
Boynton: then you grab it. Yeah. Yeah. And do all students think that way?
Seo: Most tend to.
Kingsbury: They get eaten up pretty quickly. We distribute and people take them and read them. But you value print media?
Boynton: I do. I do. But I didn’t wanna say, you know, oh, it should be a print or something like that because if the students say, “what are you talking about? That’s the most ridiculous thing I ever heard,” then I’m gonna abdicate. You’re gonna abdicate.
Kingsbury: Well, I’m glad we can get your ringing endorsement. That was really all we wanted. Do you wanna take the “Boynton gets personal” section?
Seo: Sure.
Boynton: Okay.
Kingsbury: And this is our final section.
Seo: Let’s get personal, Eric to Eric.
Boynton: Yeah. Sure.
Seo: Can you talk a little bit more about your educational background, in philosophy of religion and things like that?
Boynton: Sure.
Seo: And how do you think that helps you, if it does, as a leader of the college?
Boynton: Mhmm. Yeah. Okay. So I grew up in a household where my dad was a physicist. So, you know, for, I don’t know, centuries, physics and philosophy were like physicists were philosophers and philosophers were physicists. Right? So big questions. Plus. But I didn’t wanna, for various reasons, I didn’t wanna fall down the physics side of things. So where else do you ask big questions? Well, yes, those kinds of big questions in philosophy. And I always found myself as a kid even enamored with you know, I can remember as a 7-year-old trying to get a hold of the infinite. It’s like, “oh my gosh. That’s the most amazing thought I’ve ever thought.” You know? So early on being drawn to those kinds of intractable, large, hairy questions, kind of not petite questions, but grand challenges, those kinds of things. So and that’s when I studied in undergraduate. And when I was an undergraduate, I just caught the bug of that kind of study. And, part of me thinks I was a bit uncourageous. I, you know, maybe should have launched and done some other things, but I went straight into graduate school because that’s what I was good at. You know? You pet the dog for being a good boy, and that dog’s gonna do the same things. Right? So, went on to Vanderbilt to get my master’s and then PhD at Rice. And so that combination of philosophy and religious studies is all disciplines. I’m gonna get grief for this. But all disciplines in the college know that the highest degree is a PhD. Right? A doctor of philosophy. Because a doctor of philosophy is someone who pushes the envelope of inquiry if they’re a biologist, pushes the field of inquiry if they’re a chemist. So if you’re a philosopher, you’re constantly inquiring. There is no limit or possibility to ending inquiry. This is part of what philosophy is all about. This is why it looks like philosophy doesn’t go anywhere because you always have to go back and read Plato. Whereas other disciplines, you kinda move on. Right? You keep, but that’s why every discipline in this college, the highest degree is the doctor of philosophy. The two places that were simultaneous with philosophy is religion and art. So religion, art, philosophy. And this is the kind of the core human ways of trying to understand the world. Then philosophy begins to breed these disciplines. So all the disciplines come out of this kind of intellectual research that philosophy has started. So I’m giving you, what I think is one of the interesting ways in which I can use my philosophy degree is that I have vision or purview or visibility into a lot of disciplines because I’m essentially a curious inquiry, inquirer to the core of who I am. So I want to understand. I want to learn. I want to continue to be approaching, all those disciplines with an open and curious mind. And the other thing is that I think, a philosophical mindset means you gravitate towards hard challenging things. So running a college right now is a hard challenging thing for the reasons I told you about. It’s competitive, and it’s you know, we need to be doing better and so this is an interesting way in which how do you gather the people together? The bones are so good here. You know, the DNA of our liberal arts is so good here. How do you find a way to describe and demonstrate that value to a world that’s changing in front of us? That’s a fun thing to ask.
Kingsbury: You’re an inquirer.
Boynton: That’s right. Does this make any sense?
Kingsbury: You should teach.
Boynton: I used to. I used to.
Seo: Have you considered going into higher education?
Kingsbury: So philosophy of religion. Do you believe in God?
Boynton: This is the personal side?
Kingsbury: Yeah.
Boynton: So here’s what I wanna say to that is that I’m a president of a college in which I need to have every aspect of the human experience talked about and understood.
Kingsbury: Mhmm.
Boynton: I need to have that open space. I need to have the ability to question and engage in every topic. That’s my answer.
Kingsbury: Including…
Boynton: Including existence or belief in god, including, you know, relevant or resonant challenges to certain scientific inquiry, including, you know, ways and just everything has to be open for the table.
Kingsbury: Give me a hint. Don’t dodge this. Give me a little.
Boynton: No. It’s just a—
Kingsbury: Give me a hint.
Boynton: I’m not dodging it. I have a responsibility to make sure that the 2 of you are in a space where you will be stretched and challenged in all the ways that are important. And I do not wanna close that down. I do not wanna close that down.
Kingsbury: Fine, were your parents religious?
Boynton: I’ll answer that one. My mom is and was, and my dad, not so much.
Kingsbury: I’ll take it.
Seo: Okay. So I know if we ask you what your favorite thing about Beloit College, you’re gonna say the students.
Boynton: I am. I’m gonna say that. Yeah.
Seo: So instead, we’re gonna ask you, what’s your least favorite part about Beloit?
Kingsbury: Boom.
Boynton: My least favorite part about Beloit. Well, the big holes in the ground right now is what’s the least favorite part.
Kingsbury: Don’t come up with something diplomatic. Say something mean.
Boynton: No. I’m not gonna say something mean. I mean, I’m having trouble because I don’t see, here’s the thing. I’m generally optimistic and desire the best for people. Right?
Seo: Philosopher, generally optimistic.
Boynton: Generally optimistic. Actually, the word pessimism and optimism were both invented by philosophers. So optimism was invented by a guy named Leibniz, and pessimism was invented by a guy named Schopenhauer.
Kingsbury: I hate philosophers.
Boynton: So what I like least about?
Kingsbury: Okay. How about this. Yeah. The city? Just Beloit in general then.
Boynton: I like the city.
Kingsbury: Okay. Come on. Okay. Let’s make it easier. What’s the hardest part? What’s the most difficult part?
Boynton: Yeah. Okay. That’s a good one. That’s a good one. It’s meeting the business challenges right now. That’s the hardest thing. Thinking cleverly about how you retain the DNA of the place in a way that maps on to the current climate out there around higher ed. I mean, you guys heard the reports. I mean, it’s “college isn’t worth it. Going into debt for college is not worth it.” You know, “why would I even entertain a smaller arts college in which it doesn’t lead anywhere?” Right? Those kinds of challenges, cracking that nut. You know, those are the things that wake me up early in the morning because I do believe to the core of my being that the education we’re offering at Beloit College is the best kind of preparation for the world that you guys are encountering right now. Convincing people of that is really hard right now.
Kingsbury: Yeah.
Boynton: Right? But you’re getting set up for all sorts of ways in which you’re gonna be able to navigate the world that people in more vocational or professionally minded schools are not being prepared for. So right now, it’s because you in 10 years from now, you’re gonna have a job that doesn’t exist right now.
Kingsbury: What?
Boynton: Yeah. And you’re gonna love it.
Kingsbury: I’m gonna be sleeping on the couch.
Seo: Taking care of our robot overlords.
Kingsbury: Maybe I’ll like it. Okay. Let’s do something entertaining. What’s the most annoying part about being president? Something that maybe people don’t know comes with the job, but you wake up every morning and you go, “come on. Again?”
Seo: Maybe once a week, once a month.
Boynton: Yeah. Gosh. It’s a really hard job, but I really like my job. I like hard. Here’s the thing. I like hard jobs. I actually want to be in a job where I get sucked into it. So here’s the hardest thing. You have no choice but to live, breathe, eat this job 24/7. That’s hard, it’s also the thing I love about the job. It’s also the thing. It’s like some mornings, like, you know what? Not today. Admittedly. So, you know, every bite of my dinner, I think about this place. And I have a board of trustees, and I have a board chair that I report to. And I talk to them regularly, and we work well together. But they don’t eat Beloit College for dinner. I eat Beloit College for breakfast — I don’t eat lunch because I don’t have time — and dinner. And so that would be the challenging part, but it’s also, I believe… I always wanted a job where I just get sucked into it and I become the thing. That’s fun too. It’s like riding a wave if you’re a surfer and, you know, you’re on the cusp of this wave and you’re totally enamored and then this flow moment. Right?
Kingsbury: So you have no work-life balance or, you have the best work-life balance.
Boynton: It’s hard to tell. It’s hard to tell because I’ve given up on this idea that there’s any outside. And so, you know, conversations with my spouse, you know, those are all I mean, she’s living in the house, and we’re thinking about the space we occupy, which is essentially a campus space. We do get away. Yeah. The one place I think… my kids have are essentially fledged. It’d be difficult, I think, to have this job with young kids, to put it that way. I think I would feel very conflicted about the amount of time I spend on the job not paying attention to them.
Kingsbury: Mhmm.
Boynton: But, you know, my son’s married and, you know, has his own family and things like that. I can check in without having to parent. I can’t imagine being a parent. I’d have to figure something else out.
Kingsbury: I’m gonna keep that in mind for when I become a college president. Alright. That’s all we have.
Seo: I have one more thing.
Kingsbury: Oh, Eric has one more. I apologize.
Seo: Is there anything, like we’ve asked all these questions. Is there anything that, you wanna talk about that we didn’t ask about or anything you’d like to address or something like that? If If not, no worries. But just giving you the opportunity to talk about anything you’d like to.
Kingsbury: Do a Patreon.
Boynton: A what?
Kingsbury: A Patreon. Yeah.
Boynton: What’s that?
Kingsbury: Like, where people can give you money. I don’t know. That’s a joke. It’s just that this joke did not work.
Boynton: Yeah. I thought you might feel embarrassed. Question about generally, you know, I get it that, we’re living in a residential community, so we’re living together. So it’s both exciting and challenging, and we’re gonna rub each other wrong way. I’m gonna make missteps, and I’m gonna make mistakes, and we’re gonna drop the ball on certain occasions, but we’re always gonna desire to pick the ball up. Generally, I really wanna think, and sometimes it’s impossible all the time, but I really wanna think about this community as the whole community. Whole community. So sometimes I bristle at the idea of administration because it like, you guys. Like, I wanna sit down with you guys and talk about your experience, as president. And there’s different roles on campus, and so I have a different role than you guys do, and I shouldn’t burden you with certain responsibilities for the college. Your job is to soak up everything here in order to become the person you need to be. But what I wanna emphasize is, I wanna be a president that has that kind of whole community. I don’t wanna think about divisions or silos opening up between us. And so, if it feels like those things are opening up, come to me or email me, and we could do this again or something like that. The soup the secret sauce of this place is residential-relationship driven, and this is the DNA of the place. That’s the kind of education that fosters lifelong learning and all these skills. The administration is a part of that, which means that there should be porous boundaries between my role and the role of students. Does that make sense?
Kingsbury: That works for me. Okay.
Seo: That’s all we had.
Kingsbury: Alright. Thank you.
Boynton: Alrighty, guys. Alright. Thank you so much.
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